Speech of H.E. the Senior Minister and Minister for Foreign Affairs and Cooperation of the Government of the Democratic Republic of Timor-Leste, Nobel Peace Prize Laureate Dr. José Ramos-Horta at Heinrich Boell Foundation, Berlin, 29 November 2002: "Can Timor-Leste Become a Model for Successful Conflict Resolution?" Thank you so much, Madam, for your kind words and for the invitation extended to me to be here today. I thank the distinguished ambassadors and friends for being here. I was asked to address a topic which is whether - East Timor can serve as a model in conflict management. I might not necessarily satisfy the requirements of this topic but I will maybe just share our experience, our views and you can, from that, derive to any conclusion. Just a few weeks ago I was accompanying President Xanana Gusmão to the United Nations and to Washington for a meeting with President Bush. And some journalists asked President Xanana Gusmão: "Are you going to raise the issue of Iraq with President Bush?" And President Xanana Gusmão responded in this way: "And do you think President Bush is going to worry about my opinion on Iraq?" Well, actually President Bush began our discussion by a very forceful introduction about his views on the situation in Iraq. Of course, he didn't necessarily have in mind to ask President Xanana Gusmão to comment on that - but this is only to emphasise our own awareness, our own consciousness that we are an extremely minuscule player in the region and in world affairs. So it doesn't mean - not necessarily - that countries in the region or in the world are going to be too concerned about how we think of the matters in the region. But if we can - through our own efforts in our country, in Timor- Leste - first consolidate peace and security, build democratic institutions in the country, develop a truly tolerant democratic, pluralistic society based on rule of law, then we can say we have done our bit. Because, if there is a half-island that is peaceful, that is tolerant, if there is a half-island in the world that has addressed seriously the issue of poverty or of domestic violence, that has brought clean water, electricity to its people, maybe that is already a small contribution we can make to the rest of the world - without necessarily having the ambition to do much more than that. So I can start by saying that first our primary concern and our primary obligation - not only to our people but also to the region and to the international community - is how we build our country, how we satisfy the needs, the expectations of the people, how successful we are in building strong democratic institutions, checks and balances, so that corruption and abuse do not invade East Timorese society. Yesterday our President Xanana Gusmão made a very forceful speech. Quite unusual - for many observers, they would say - for a President to be so forceful in criticising the government. He actually demanded the resignation of a cabinet minister. And I am saying that because it has been all over in the media and I have been asked to comment. Some people are worried - you know - about the tensions, the conflict between the presidency and the government, the government and the parliament. Not to mention the tensions between the government and our very active, increasingly active, vocal NGO community. Our Prime Minister becomes increasingly irritated with our NGO community. Well, but these are all the necessary and the healthy aspects of democracy. The tensions that exist are there. They are no secrets. Between the President and the government, and between the government and the parliament - even though the government has majority control in the parliament. The government can easily push any legislation it wants through the parliament because it has the clear majority, plus it has the support of two other parties. So it could do anything it wants. But the government found out, the Prime Minister found out, that even his own parliamentarians are very independent-minded. That they don't necessarily always follow the Prime Minister's wishes. So our Prime Minister gets even more irritated with this development. And I find this whole situation very interesting, healthy. Why not? Why wouldn't the President become the spokesperson of the concerns of the people? Why wouldn't he speak out? Why wouldn't he put pressure, constant pressure, on the government? And so these are the tensions that are there. I wouldn't say that our Prime Minister and a few others who worked with him and international experts on the constitution, we planned it deliberately in such a way to really have a system of a balance. Maybe there was some miscalculation by our Prime Minister. He didn't think that the President - you know - could become so independent-minded or maybe he didn't think that his own parliamentarians would become so independent-minded. Maybe it was not calculated but the fact, the end result is positive: It's positive that we have these tensions between the President and the government and the parliament. Because this means: No one has monopoly on power - and with temptation of using and abusing power. The way the constitution was drafted and voted on by the people gives enough checks and balances, division of power between the various branches of our government. Of course, on top of it we have a President who is extremely popular. The single most popular individual in the country is the President with an enormous moral authority. So he is able to exercise this very special role to make sure that we as a whole, we those who are in government and in other political functions, do not betray the expectation, the dreams, the sacrifices of so many people. Our bishop to make things even more dramatic - one of our bishops, Bishop Belo who shared the Nobel Prize with me also, - resigned a few days ago. He invoked health reasons. Some media speculated that he has resigned because of some conflict with the Vatican over - I don't know: theological or biblical interpretation of human phenomena? I've no idea. The fact of the matter is that he resigned. I was not there on the moment of his resignation. I cannot really share with you how our people reacted. But from my conversation on the phone there was tremendous calm, serenity in the country. Bishop Belo probably has genuine health concerns. As you know he was the leader of the church for so many years in extremely difficult circumstances. And probably he feels that he has to leave and he left. That the way the people reacted in a very calm, serene way, shows also the strength of the church, shows the positive legacy of the Bishop. That when he decided to leave there is no commotion. There a many priests, church leaders in East Timor who will be able to continue on the extraordinary role that Bishop Belo played in the past. Sharing with you these two particular events - the dramatic speech of our President criticising the government, demanding the resignation of a cabinet minister, and Bishop Belo's resignation - is only to say that a few months after our independence, the hand-over of sovereignty of East Timor, we are going through still a very dynamic democratic process with enormous popular participation. We have twelve parties in the parliament - the largest is the Fretilin historical party. And there are thirty per cent women in the parliament, the largest number of women in any parliament in the region. And the average of the European Union parliaments is eighteen per cent. Only Norway, Sweden, Finland - maybe the Nordic countries - have a higher percentage of women in parliament. We have also a very dynamic media- not necessarily always very responsible. If you want to find the more imaginative media in the world, go to East Timor. They make up interviews, the make up stories. If they didn't do an interview with the Minister, they make up the interview. This is an area where one can train our journalists. Please come and do as many trainings as you can. In East Timor they need to learn to write properly, they need to learn not to make up stories, they need to learn to do serious investigative reporting rather than just making up accusations against different individuals. We need real training for our print media particularly. Radio, electronic and television is slightly better because they cannot make up stories, you know, people are watching, people are listening. But the print media has this advantage over all the others that they can make up totally non-existent facts. But I don't want to offend the German print media. I don't want to create any enemies among the German print media. I am talking about our specific experience in East Timor. Our judiciary is also one aspect of our administration that is not the most successful so far. Our courts hardly function and that has mostly to do with the fact that in the whole country we have very, very few trained lawyers, trained prosecutors. That doesn't mean necessarily that lawyers are the best invention of humanity. But in East Timor we really lack qualified, trained lawyers. Our courts really don't function. We have general support from many countries - from Portugal, from Cape Verde, from Brazil - and the United Nations through UNDP is searching out for more prosecutors and judges to make up for our problems there. My point is only to share with you that, in these few months, we have learned through our mistakes and weaknesses the enormous challenge of governance. At the same time as we do that, we try to create an economy where it did not exist to meet the rising demand and expectation of the people. And at the same time we are working towards normalisation of relations with Indonesia, developing relations with our neighbours, being an active participant in the United Nations system. I move on to the next point that I want to make and that is our relations with Indonesia. In July this year President Xanana Gusmão paid a state visit to Indonesia. As I was there with the President and other colleagues I could not help but being overwhelmed and touched by the warmth, the reception accorded to President Xanana Gusmão. Obviously, as we all know, East Timor went through twenty-five years of violence, of suffering, of humiliation. But at the same time you can also understand the other side - and that is that for Indonesia also it was a humiliating experience, when in '99 it was forced to leave the country. And it needs quite a lot of courage for the other side to acknowledge the irreversibility, the reality of Timor-Leste's independence, and so soon after the traumatic events of '99 to seek to meet us half way in normalising relations. In this regard the Indonesian side, starting with President Gus Dur - Abdurrahman Wahid - and with Megawati Sukarnoputri, have shown real leadership and statesmanship. We have established a joined commission, interministerial, that has had its first meeting in October in Jakarta. And - working with Indonesia, with Australia, New Zealand, Papua New Guinea and the Philippines - we have launched a new subregional organisation called the South West Pacific Dialogue. And that is an Indonesian initiative which we inaugurated also … in October in Yogyakarta. The agenda of the new subregional organisation is subregional cooperation on security issues, people smuggling, drug trafficking , human trafficking, but it is also to address security cooperation to deal with the terrorist threat and so on. We are opening an embassy in Jakarta. We have already some diplomats there. The embassy will start functioning in January. Indonesia has an embassy in Timor. We are working to continue to strengthen relations with Indonesia, in particular to develop trade and economic cooperation between Timor-Leste and Eastern Indonesia, the islands, the provinces that are nearest to East Timor. We have also established relations with all ASEAN countries. Some of them have embassies in East Timor. We have embassies from Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand and soon we will have from the Philippines. President Gloria Arroyo has told me in the Philippines recently that she will be appointing an ambassador to East Timor. In the region we have also strong ties with China, with Korea, with Japan; besides Australia and New Zealand that I already mentioned. This has been our very, very heavy agenda in the last few months. On December 10th our parliament will ratify the most relevant, the most important international human rights instruments making East Timor one of the countries that is acceding to ratify the largest number of international human rights instruments: Convention on the Rights of the Child, Convention on Refugees, Convention against Torture and many others. But we are not only ratifying them, we are conscious that ratification brings also responsibility: responsibility to the people and responsibility to the international community. We are asking UNICEF, UNHCHR, the UN agencies and donor countries to help us publishing theses treaties - in book-form with illustrations, appropriate for school children because we really want to popularise the international human rights instruments and be part and parcel of the daily discourse of the people, the daily understanding, so that human rights, democracy become part of the culture of the country. I would like now to touch on one issue that has been very much in the mind of all of us and that is the threat of terrorism in the region and in the world. A few weeks ago I travelled through Denpasar on the way to Singapore, Thailand and Korea. And on the way back we stopped there. It was most heart-breaking to see the Denpasar airport almost completely empty and we know that at least two weeks ago the hotels had less than ten per cent occupancy. The terrorist threat, the strategy of the terrorists is having its impact. Their strategy is to undermine the economies and the governments of the region. I am talking about our immediate region. Bali without tourism - if the situation continues they will lose several hundred thousands of jobs and certainly that undermines the stability of the government in Indonesia as a whole and particular in Bali. And the same impact is happening in our economies in the region. I don't know so far about the impact on Thailand itself. But the Thai authorities - as have been the Philippines and Singapore, Malaysia - are all worried about the impact of the terrorist threat. President Xanana Gusmão and myself, we decided on the way back to stop in Denpasar. We stayed there over night and went to visit the site of the terrorist bombing. Not only to pay tribute to the victims but also to make an appeal to tourists, to people in the region not to allow ourselves to be hostages of the terrorists. If we allow ourselves to be hostages of the fear they want to instil in each of us, we are doing exactly what they want. Their strategy is to undermine the governments in the region by undermining one of the most important sources of income for the economies of the region. We understand the fears of those who travel and we understand the fears of Western governments that have to issue travel warnings to their citizens: No government, no responsible government is prepared to be indifferent to the terrorist threat and to ignore the need to warn their citizens. But we must all bear in mind that tourism, the movement of people in today's world, which involves millions and millions of people, is vital to the economies of the world. It is not only Bali that would suffer, it's the whole of Indonesia that would suffer. It will not be only Phuket and Thailand. But it would affect airlines, Western airline industry. It does affect the aeronautics industry. And it affects all the related activities that are linked with tourism, directly or indirectly. Sometimes I have to say frankly, sometimes when you look at some of the travel warnings you wonder whether these travel warnings are really justified. I do not wish to oversimplify matters. Certainly, we make our decision whether to travel to Singapore or not, to Bali or not. But is Bali today less safe than downtown Los Angeles? Is Bali today less safe than Columbine, Colorado? Is Bali today less safe than the Central Park? We don't hear travel warnings about the United States. I have taken part personally in programs in the United States in healing victims of violence in schools. In Columbine High School: I went there, I was asked to go there to talk with the families of the two sides: of the children who killed, who killed their friends, their colleagues - to talk with the community. So I am very familiar with the scale of violence in the United States. And yet does it prevent us from going to the United States? Either for tourist purpose or business purpose? Are we being stopped to go to UK or to France or to Germany because of the terrorist threat? Because everybody is under terrorist threat. The fact that there is no travel warning in Germany, or no travel warning in Canada, or no travel warning in the United States doesn't mean that the terrorists are not going to strike. Bali was the one of the safest places. And that's why maybe people were complacent about it. Then it was struck. Being conscious, being aware of all these dangers, the threat that faces all of us, we cannot allow ourselves to fall into the trap of the terrorists and in the process undermine entire economies and bring even more instability to many parts of the world. I can talk about this issue rather objectively because, unfortunately, East Timor is not exactly today a major tourist destination. No one is really still going to East Timor. We are not Bali, we are not Fiji, we are not this very famous place in Miami, Disney World or whatever. So the terrorist threat is not really affecting East Timor but it's heart-breaking and worrying to us observing how it is affecting economies of the region. It is profoundly affecting that extraordinary people of Bali. We in East Timor so far have been immune. But that doesn't mean that Timor is escaping the terrorist threat. Osama Bin Laden - in at least two statements he made a specific reference to East Timor. The mere fact that Bali is a Hindu enclave in an archipelago that is predominantly… Muslim that in itself is a target for Osama Bin Laden. Or if you are a moderate Muslim leader you make yourself a target. East Timor by the fact it is a predominantly Catholic enclave and according to Osama Bin Laden taken away from Muslim Indonesia by Western crusaders and this makes East Timor a target. We are aware, we are conscious of that. But that is not going to stop us from continuing to build our nation through democracy, democratic principles, institutions and tolerance. And it will not push us into demonising every Muslim in the world, into blinding us, into falling into the trap that the terrorist threat is a natural product of the Arab or Muslim world. My point is that in the fight against terrorism we cannot not at the same time allow ourselves to fall into the tap of demonising other cultures or ethnic groups because - and speaking as a Catholic, as a Christian: well, the history of Christianity is not exactly the most violent-free one. If we remember our history it is not exactly the most violent-free one. So let us not generalise and demonise others. And I want to say one thing here in connection with this: If the East Timorese people, if the East Timorese leaders can be proud of one that is: Never once in twenty-four years of our struggle we demonised the Indonesian people as a people…Although East Timor is predominantly Catholic and Indonesia is predominantly Muslim, you never saw in our official pronouncements of any sort any manipulation of religion as instruments of our struggle. Unfortunately, or tragically, the Suharto regime in Indonesia could be accused of everything. It could be accused of corruption, of nepotism, of abuse. But it could not be accused of discrimination when it came to violence. Everybody in Indonesia knew what was violence under Suharto -whether you are Muslim, whether you are Hindu, whether you are Catholic from East Timor or you are Protestant from Irian Jaya, West Papua. So we all know what it is when it came to violence. So, Suharto never discriminated when it came to violence. So the violence in East Timor was not because East Timor was Catholic under Suharto and the East Timorese people understood that very well. And that is why twenty-four years after Indonesian occupation and after so much suffering, and still so many people unaccounted for, normalisation of relations with Indonesia has been very easy, very quick. There are Indonesians living in East Timor today. Many are coming back, although Timor is the poorest country in Asia. We have now our share of illegal migrants, many of them from Indonesia. Partly not because we are so tolerant but because our border services are so incompetent. They let people in and out without papers, without passports which is a bit worrying at the moment. We do have over a thousand of illegal migrants in East Timor. How they ended up there only our very competent border services can explain. But the fact of the matter: They are there and they are working illegally: street vendors, restaurants - and there is no physical or verbal abuse against Indonesians who decided to stay there. I end with one message. I was asked a few weeks ago on …UN Day, 24th of October, to talk about how East Timor can contribute to the United Nations, to contribute to the world as member of the United Nations. I said now and I would say today: Not much because of our smallness, our insignificance - but we would join our voice with the voice of many developing countries, with the NGOs around the world, in calling on the rich countries of the North to increase further their share of the development assistance for poor countries: to the minimum zero point seven per cent recommended by the UN. But that is not enough either because the fifty billion dollars or so that is contributed by the rich countries to development assistance programs around the world is almost completely obliterated by the farming subsidies that rich countries provide to their farmers. Three hundred billion dollars are estimated by UNDP to be the subsidies by the rich countries to farmers in Europe and…the United States. You have the amount of more or less fifty billion dollars of overseas assistance … to poor countries. You have three hundred billion dollars in farming subsidies in rich countries. How can a small farmer somewhere in East Timor compete with these huge subsidies? And then we have the debt burden of the poor countries. We can add our voice. It's not only a moral and ethical issue but it's also a matter of pragmatism and security, a strategic consideration: Maybe it is time that we, the world today -and as we are all shaking by the terrorist threat-, that we realise that we have to engage - all of us - in a better dialogue, better communication, a better vision, a greater courage, more compassion - but not only compassion and vision - but courage and intelligence. In looking seriously at how the rich countries can really address the issue of poverty. Poverty is not only a moral and ethical issue - poverty is also a security issue. I do not obviously agree with the very simplistic notion that terrorism is caused by poverty. That is nonsense. Saying that poverty is a source of terrorism, or one fundamental source, is essentially an insult to the poor of the world. Look at Sub-Saharan Africa - there is no more neglected, more humiliated, more looted region of the world than Sub-Saharan Africa. Going back to colonial rule, slavery, Sub-Saharan Africa, particularly Southern Africa but also the Horn of Africa, has been used, abused, manipulated by every major power during the cold war. And yet you don't find local terrorist groups born, operating out of Sub-Saharan Africa. They are victims of violence and instability from within and without. But it challenges the notion, the myth… that poverty breeds terrorism. But if poverty does not cause terrorism, poverty causes instability. It bring down the governments destabilising the countries. And that is true. And how can we create the conditions to create a better, safer environment for everybody. For the poor and for the rich. The poor cannot prosper without the rich. And let me assure you: The rich will not stay always rich, if regions of the world remain poor. So it is important to write off the debts of the poor countries. Why do the Western banks and governments loan and loan indiscriminately knowing that there is corruption there? Well, you are also at fault … and you collected enough. So write off the debt, increase market access. Reduce gradually - we are not saying reduce completely or cut off completely - the farming subsidies. You know, we can demand, "yes, you must stop immediately farming subsidies" -but it is not realistic. But we can expect that over a period of years… it can be gradually reduced. So that makes our farmers more competitive with the rest of the world. And that's what we are proposing. And we propose that a country like Germany, the European Union, really leads a dialogue between the various regions, communities … of the world. In our small way, in our daily lives in East Timor we discover that sometimes you can defuse an intractable issue through dialogue. When you see an angry crowd, you have the courage you go and face them and invite them to dialogue. You disarm them. So at a larger level, national or regional level, the global level, there has to be other creative, dynamic ways to engage the various regions that do not seem to understand each other. How to do it? Frankly, of course, there are so many dialogue initiatives that I am not going to invent a new one. I just want to add my voice to those who say there has to be greater dialogue to avoid the evil side winning the propaganda war - winning the propaganda war that Americans are against Muslims, winning the propaganda war that Europeans are with Americans against Muslims and vice-versa. It is not the case. That is not true. The US is not against Muslims. When the United States refused to intervene in Bosnia, when dragging its feet for a long time, or when Nato countries were hesitating to intervene in Kosovo they were being criticised by everybody. But then, when they finally intervened, they are still criticised. Well, something wrong there. There is some miscommunication. It is very, very important that in the fight against international terrorism one cannot lose sight of the need for dialogue. You cannot use only security, military approach to conflicts. You must address the issue of the social and economic dimension. And this is in a small way our experience in East Timor. East Timor has been labelled a success story for the UN. East Timor, yes, it has been very much a success story and thanks to the UN. The UN be justly praised for what is has done in East Timor. But the UN is the sum of the parts. The parts are the member states. And the member states contribute significantly to that. The European Union and some of its member countries have contributed generously to East Timor, the Nordic countries, Portugal, Ireland, the European Union as a group, Australia, New Zealand, Japan. And different countries have - in different ways - helped to end the violence in '99 and in the reconstruction… efforts. What Timor can show - and I end my comments with that - is that the UN is absolutely the best vehicle for the international community to gather together, work together, to try to address to resolve conflict situations. This success story of East Timor - it was not done out of to one particular country. It was a contributing effort of many. Some say that East Timor was an Australian imposition against Indonesia. Not true. Many Asian countries used friendly persuasion with Indonesia in '99 to understand that it was time to leave. The ASEAN countries played a…crucial role behind the scenes. China, Korea and Japan. So it was a collaborative effort of many countries that ended the violence in '99. But it was not only governments. Civil societies, NGOs, our solidarity movement were so active, so generous, in so many parts of the world including in Germany. What Timor offers is, yes, the lesson of Timor is a lesson of hope, a lesson of partnership, of collaborative effort of people of goodwill in governments and outside. Can this be replicated elsewhere? Yes, it can. But I don't want also to simplify to say: "It worked in one place, it works in another." There are specific realities in each country. And one is that I advise the UN: Don't get involved, don't waste the resources, the credibility of the UN, if local actors are not able to have the courage to come to terms and end violence. The UN should not jump into situations where the different factions in one given country are not ready. Because in the end, the success story of East Timor, yes, is tremendously due to the UN but also to the ability of the Timorese people to bury the violence and the past. Because if the people of East Timor were not prepared to bury their differences, no amount of peace-keeping would be able to keep peace in the country. We ourselves must be the primary, the number one peacemakers. The others can help, consolidate peace and rebuild the country. But they cannot fill our hearts with compassion, with love, when we don't have the courage to forgive, to reconcile among ourselves. When leaders are not able to put behind them the rivalries of the past. When leaders are not able to be inspired by the greater good of the country, then the UN should not be there because it would not succeed. I thank you. ==========================================================================